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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi George and all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Keep in mind, I was up and running on 220 at the
old location, so I know what to expect regarding propogation. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My assessment of the band is that given the same
path and comparable equipment, it will do pretty much the same thing in the same
way, only with some degree of "enhancement" that seems ever
present.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Based on this, I already know that my 10 elements
on 10 feet should be sufficient to handle my "horizontal weak signal" tasks, as
that arrangement (despite being half the antenna) performed similarly to my 2
meter horizontal set up with regard to range and signal reports, and the
activity on that polarization will likely always be "net nights and contests"
and occasional "Oh, I have 220, want to try it?" stuff.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Vertically speaking, If it were a busy band, I
would simply plant a pair of 10 element yagis on the cross boom between the 6
meter vertical yagis and be done with it (again, duplicating my array of choice
on 2 meter vertical), however I don't expect the activity would warrant the
extra load and space requirements.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I guess I'm just trying to get a handle on what
would be best for now to work the activity that exists and to be ready for some
that MIGHT exist if we are able to promote some activity. I've found one
of the best ways to do that is to set an example as to how well the band CAN
work, and then others will follow.....</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Using this rationale, I am hoping to breathe a
little life into things by entering the local scene with a formidable enough
signal to work all that are presently there, as well as to prove to those that
aren't making enough effort for it to work that a step or two "up" would
certainly produce results.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I'm just not sure if the amp and a decent gain
omni placed nicely on top of the stack here would be enough to
do that. Going to the beam would give me something to do if the
local scene bombs, but it may be too much if I want to set an example
of "obtainable performance".</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2>As far as the choice of omni goes, it comes
down to the Bozak and the CX-333.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2><STRONG>Bozak good points</STRONG>: no caps
to blow, proven 2x5/8 design in a two piece "screw together" (same as the
Antron) set up that is light, durable, and totally fool proof. Plug and
play. Relatively cheap as compared to the Comet (roughly
$86.00).</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><STRONG>Bozak "bad" points</STRONG>: "might" be
lesser performer than the CX-333 due to the "Japanese magic" factor (I'll
explain further down), is electrically shorter, and less versatile than the
Comet.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><STRONG>Comet good points</STRONG>: 3x5/8 design is
electrically speaking, the "longest" antenna being offered for 222 in a
vertical omni presently. (it should be noted however that it is not the ONLY
one) </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>"Japanese magic"....</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>for some reason, a "multibanded" Japanese antenna
by Comet or Diamond always outperforms a traditional single banded antenna of
the "same" design (2x5/8, 3x5/8, etc). Best as I can figure, this is
a "by product" of it's obligatory multiband components that must just by chance
force the "current points" to be more advantageously placed than the
"traditional" design.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Flexibility.....by using no more space than the
Bozak, I could add a reasonable gain 2 meter vertical to the upstairs station,
as well as free up the GP-9 (to be mounted over the garage some time in the
future) for the downstairs station's exclusive use (I'd been fretting over how
to keep sharing the GP-9 from being a problem).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><STRONG>Comet "bad" points</STRONG>: the complexity
of the multibanded design requires the inherent "weak link", the disc
capacitor. While my max power at the shack end will be 150 watts, this has
been enough to "pop" Japanese models rated at 200 watts before, and the Comet is
only rated at 120.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The price...lowest I've found so far is roughly
$160.00</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Others....</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hustler makes a triple 5/8 single band antenna with
great power handling and sturdy design, however it's not cheap and it is not
light enough for my mounting locations.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jetstream's "knock off" design gets bad reviews
(specifically as compared to the CX-333 I might add), and my experience (as well
as many other we all know) is that the low price knock offs are plagued with
quality control issues.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Now, (George) to the unanswered
questions:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>How many of your group are on or capable of being
on?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Where are they located, and what are they
using?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=gandrews@ntplx.net href="mailto:gandrews@ntplx.net">George
Andrews</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=450@lists.vhfwiki.com
href="mailto:450@lists.vhfwiki.com">144.450 Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, June 26, 2010 12:11
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [450] 222 ponderings, GEORGE
take note!</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Bob,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Repeater activity seems close to two meters
fairly often. There is of course less repeaters on 220. It is hard to compare
the two. Ran mobile for a couple of months and activity levels were close (80%
compared to 2 M) West Haven and Milford repeaters are inactive presently,
don't know why. <STRONG>It also looks like owners are not repairing 220
repeaters when they fail. Something to keep in mind as it may reflect general
thoughts about 220</STRONG>. I like the Isopole, Covers a pretty good area in
terms of repeaters. There is not enough activity to determine simplex
performance unfortunately. The only data I have found indicates 3dbd gain,
nothing spectacular. I think the angle of radiation is what makes this antenna
decent. The CX333 looks great in terms of gain! Plus you have triband
capability with pretty good gain figures. I don't know what the cost
differential is between Bozak and CX333. I would likely go with the CX333 as I
don't think you could do any better. Have you looked at the JetStream antenna?
<A
href="http://www.jetstream-usa.com/jtb5.shtml">http://www.jetstream-usa.com/jtb5.shtml</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>My advice is to go with a vertical to start with.
See what you can do with repeaters and see how simplex activity is from your
location. From what I have seen, there are days when the band will amaze you.
Other days, the performance will feel like 70 or 33 cm! Get some
operating experience with a decent vertical and judge for yourself whether the
band warrants any further effort. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have a four element end mount Cushcraft
antenna. It is on mast only and not very high and has limited direction. I
plan to put that in a better location and have a rotor. Once I get that up, I
will see how things perform with that. Once that is up, I do not plan to
develop the 220 station any further. I originally planned to pick up another
Jetstream radio for the truck. There is not enough simplex activity to justify
the expense. If I want to use repeaters, 2 M/70 cm is all that is
neccesary. If I want to do 220 from the truck, I will just move the
radio.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Remember 220 Tuesday nights.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have a foldable jPole for 220 and was using a
coax groundplane. I won't part with the jPole and the gp went into the trasdh
a while ago. K1FBI may have something he might sell.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Let me know when you (or anyone else) are ready
to do any testing.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>George</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=N1UJS@toast.net href="mailto:N1UJS@toast.net">Bob</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=450@lists.vhfwiki.com
href="mailto:450@lists.vhfwiki.com">144.450 Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, June 26, 2010 12:52
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [450] 222 ponderings, GEORGE
take note!</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I'm trying to decide how much space to allocate
to 220 vertical, and what level of gain to bother with....</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Simplest option is a Bozak 2x5/8.....SOME gain,
sturdy, no caps to blow out, permanently flat swr, and wouldn't take up any
space allocated for something else (on top of the 2 meter
stack).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Next step up would be a CX-333.....could go in
the same spot, take up the same space, offer slightly more gain, also could
be tied through a triplexer to the upstairs station for 2 meter vertical
option and the downstairs station for 440 vertical. Rather expensive,
but gets good reviews.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Next step would be a vertical yagi of the
smaller "end mount" variety....more gain, but takes up more mast
space.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If I do this however, I may as well go with a
longer yagi and get more gain as it wouldn't take up any more mast
space....perhaps I could mount it slightly off center on the crossboom for
the 2x3 6 meter setup. I already have the 10 element homebrew, so this
would be a fairly quick fix with minimal outlay.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I guess what it comes down to is just how much
activity is really happening right now? </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> How many people are in George's group and
at what distance and how widely scattered are they? </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If it is a small group and fairly close by, a
small stick would suffice. On the other hand, if activity is limited,
a long yagi could give me something to do...mapping out the distant
repeaters and such......and maybe even being able to check into the
"Pakrats" FM net......</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Will anyone else from our group be joining the
game?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Any thoughts?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Anything already discarded and available in the
"stick" variety among your group George?</FONT></DIV>
<P>
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